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Old 02-24-2011   #1
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Obama Disses DOMA

As a presidential candidate, Barack Obama said he was against homosexual marriage. Many people at the time suspected he was intentionally being dishonest for political expediency, because he thought it would hurt his chances to beat John McCain if he said he was in favor of homosexual marriage.
Now the truth is out...he was lying, and it looks like he doesn't care that he lied, or isn't planning on repenting in any way for doing so.
Therefore, he cannot be trusted.

Even people experiencing same sex attraction/gender identity confusion and/or have embraced it as an identity, should be very concerned about this.
Whether you agree with same sex "marriage" or not, this sets a dangerous precedent when a president decides which federal laws his administration will defend and which they will not.

In essence, this changes our government from the rule of law to the rule of one man who decides himself which laws he will enforce and which he will not.
This is what "kings" do in tyrannical empires...

What is at stake in the issue:

- The common sense idea that every child should have a right to be raised in a home with both a mom and a dad

- Whether America will be forced to accept the bizarre, court-invented claim that men and women are interchangeable

- Whether Americans will be forced to surrender their freedom to set public policy to a small group of wealthy activists who wish to impose their will on a state or an entire nation

- Whether marriage will remain a unique institution that promotes the important interests of children and society…

- Whether voters may freely consider their own moral and religious views about marriage…or be forced by violence and intimidation to remain silent

- Whether voters may collectively decide through the democratic process that marriage between one man and woman should be protected
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Old 02-25-2011   #2
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

Are you being serious?
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Old 02-25-2011   #3
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

Yes, very serious, and many many more share the same concern. When two women claim they are capable of having the same relationship as a man and woman do, the implication to that claim is that a man's contribution to relationships, marriage, and family is replaceable and unnecessary. And two men claiming their relationship is just as much a relationship or marriage as a heterosexual committed relationship, implicitly dismisses any contribution of every woman, thus also claiming women are inconsequential to relationships, marriage, and family. This is REAL (gender) discrimination.


And that is not the only concern either.
The more same sex "marriage" becomes legalized, the following example is going to proliferate...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsfIVCotQn8

They are starting to do this Pavlonian style brainwashing on children in public schools http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ku1cyAhGO-g in Massachusetts and throughout other states ever since they legalized same sex "marriage" in them. They start of by exposing 4-5 yr olds to book about same sex couples like shown in the video, and then weed in books/pamphlets like this one...

(Warning: Graphic Material)
http://www.article8.net/downloads/LittleBlackBook.pdf

Parents aren't notified when these social engineering indoctrination "lessons" like this take place, and they cannot opt their children out.
One father in Massaachusetts was actually thrown in jail overnight for trying to opt out his kid...
http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=77632
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Old 02-25-2011   #4
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

And until laws are ruled unconstitutional, then they are enforced. Do I find ObamaCare harmful? Yes. And it has been struck down in various courts, although not fully ruled unconstitutional yet. I believe it's deleterious and harmful. It's in place right now, and I'm ticked off. Can I do anything about it now? No. But various Attorney Generals are adamantly working to repeal it. If Obama can not implement or enforce federal law, because it has been struck down in federal courts, someone ought to tell all those states prepping to implement Obamacare that the federal courts have ruled THAT law unconstitutional as well.
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Old 02-25-2011   #5
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

Quote:
Originally Said by Funk*Sonic*7 View Post
As a presidential candidate, Barack Obama said he was against homosexual marriage. Many people at the time suspected he was intentionally being dishonest for political expediency, because he thought it would hurt his chances to beat John McCain if he said he was in favor of homosexual marriage.
Now the truth is out...he was lying, and it looks like he doesn't care that he lied, or isn't planning on repenting in any way for doing so.
Therefore, he cannot be trusted.
Obama stated as early as 2007 that he was against DOMA and DADT.

So, I'm not seeing the lie.
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Old 02-25-2011   #6
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6K9d...eature=related

http://abcnews.go.com/WN/Politics/st...5178123&page=4
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Old 02-25-2011   #7
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

^ None of that refutes my point. In fact, the YouTube video confirms what I said.

He can be against homosexual marriage and think that DOMA is a bad law at the same time. That's been his position since at least 2007.

So, where's the lie?
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Old 02-25-2011   #8
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

His lie is that he made the public believe one thing and now he is disregarding this country’s overwhelming support for DOMA. This president will go even further, forcing employers to subsidize homosexual "relationships" by law, creating a specially protected class for distribution of specific benefits. And since there are no laws that “take rights away” from homosexuals — he certainly didn’t and couldn’t specify any — he will see to it that this special class of people will be extended more rights than heterosexuals. Talk about divisive and deceptive efforts.

Societies reap many benefits from natural marriage, therefore marriage — and family, something the homosexuals cannot sustain on their own — serves the common good and deserves protection. Marriage is a universally accepted and recognized institution that is the foundation for any — crossing all cultures and over millennia — civil society, human progress, and general flourishing of humanity. By granting a higher status to those with disordered appetites, or animalistic appetites, or any deviation outside of the Natural Law — where would it end? — one would destroy a civilized society in short order, creating havoc, and an immoral cesspool.

"Do not doubt the direction we are heading and the destination we will reach,” were the arrogant and challenging words of the president.

We have no doubt the direction he wishes to plunge all Americans. That’s why we intend to stand firm in our convictions, according to the Natural Law our Creator has given us.
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Old 02-25-2011   #9
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

I used to just think you were a little eccentric. Now, I know your just ignorant.

Quote:
The common sense idea that every child should have a right to be raised in a home with both a mom and a dad
Having a single gay parent, or two gay parents is better than having no parents at all. I suppose we should fine or penalize all those single straight moms and single straight dads out there? You must seriously have a brain defect.... If theres any effect of having gay parents, the child may actually be tolerant of others, rather than be taught to hate for stupid reasons found in an old book for fairy tales.

Quote:
Whether America will be forced to accept the bizarre, court-invented claim that men and women are interchangeable
No one is saying anyone is interchangeable. People just want to love who they want.

Quote:
- Whether Americans will be forced to surrender their freedom to set public policy to a small group of wealthy activists who wish to impose their will on a state or an entire nation
How dare they! They want equal rights as the rest of the nation!?!? These people are still supposedly going to hell, why should you give a fuck what they do IN THEIR OWN DAMN LIVES.

Quote:
- Whether marriage will remain a unique institution that promotes the important interests of children and society…
Since straight people hold marriage in such a high regard now, right?

Quote:
- Whether voters may freely consider their own moral and religious views about marriage…or be forced by violence and intimidation to remain silent
Your forcing the LGBT people to remain in silence... this bullet mark could be considered satire, since its the majority of straight religious folk that are commiting the violence and intimidation. Youre clearly brain dead.

Quote:
- Whether voters may collectively decide through the democratic process that marriage between one man and woman should be protected
What happened to giving people equal rights, no matter what or where they come from? That seems a little more American to me, than just protecting what an old book of fairy tales and a bunch of rich white people say.


You're so far off-base with what is right and wrong, I hoped you were kidding.
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Old 02-25-2011   #10
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

Quote:
Originally Said by Funk*Sonic*7 View Post

We have no doubt the direction he wishes to plunge all Americans. That’s why we intend to stand firm in our convictions, according to the Natural Law our Creator has given us.

And which law is that? I hope you don't mean the book written by people in the desert who thought rainbows and thunder were indicators of god's emotions?
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Old 02-25-2011   #11
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

"I used to just think you were a little eccentric. Now, I know your just ignorant."

Interesting, because I had and still have no opinion of you.

"Having a single gay parent, or two gay parents is better than having no parents at all. I suppose we should fine or penalize all those single straight moms and single straight dads out there? You must seriously have a brain defect.... If theres any effect of having gay parents, the child may actually be tolerant of others, rather than be taught to hate for stupid reasons found in an old book for fairy tales."

So we model our society by our tragedies, exceptions, and/or our failures? If a child's mother dies, we seek to surround that child with solid mother figure roles, and not exclude the gender altogether. You won't find this occurring in most homosexual parenting, for there's a deep rooted issue as to why they're only attracted to the same sex in the first place. Plus, you somehow are ignoring the straight upward trend of HIV and STDs rates in the homosexual community as a direct consequence of homosexual sex, of which they only acct for 3-4% of the population. You're ignoring the studies have shown that even in homosexual-friendly societies like the Netherlands, that conclusively show that homosexuals still suffer from psychological problems at least 4Xs greater. You are also overlooking the truth that crimes on homosexuals occur by other homosexuals 244% more frequently than from heteros as reported by pro-homosexual org NCAVP, all as a direct result of homosexual feelings/behavior.

"No one is saying anyone is interchangeable. People just want to love who they want."

In fact they are...ever hear of "queer theory?" And the purpose of marriage is the procreation of children, plain and simple. Everything is predicated from that purpose when dealing with the definition of marriage. A brother loves his sister, should they marry? A man loves his dog and his dog loves him, should they marry?

"How dare they! They want equal rights as the rest of the nation!?!? These people are still supposedly going to hell, why should you give a fuck what they do IN THEIR OWN DAMN LIVES."

They already have the right to marry the opposite sex, just as I do. You (like many others) are going off the false belief the homosexuality is an identity, and not a feeling/behavior. You don't pass laws based on the whims of men and women, but only what is grounded in right reason and Natural Law, which applies universally to all of us. If you want to know what the homosexual agenda is really about, don't watch Will and Grace or the movie Philadelphia, instead go to a "gay pride" parade.

http://www.gendermatters.org.au/Home...low%20res).pdf

"Since straight people hold marriage in such a high regard now, right?"

Privations are the exception, not the rule. So again, we don't justify behaviors by other failed behaviors, or promote our vices as virtues by comparing them to other vices. The goal is to encourage the proliferation of natural families (mother, father, and children). I also believe that no-fault divorces aren't right either, and have been very vocal about that with my politicians as well.

"Your forcing the LGBT people to remain in silence... this bullet mark could be considered satire, since its the majority of straight religious folk that are commiting the violence and intimidation. You're clearly brain dead."

That's interesting, because most Christians advocate kindness for people experiencing same sex attraction, and the violence you speak of for some reason can never be proven by homosexual activists when asked for legitimate examples. Though I'm not saying it doesn't occur, but it is hardly the epidemic that is propagated to the general public.

"What happened to giving people equal rights, no matter what or where they come from? That seems a little more American to me, than just protecting what an old book of fairy tales and a bunch of rich white people say. You're so far off-base with what is right and wrong, I hoped you were kidding."

Like I stated, they are already given the same rights I have to marry someone of the opposite sex. And one doesn't need to be a Bible thumper to know that. I'm not off-base, you're just being a sucker for the emotional manipulation of the homosexual activists "victim card" passion play, and therefore walking around with your eyes wide shut...

http://www.tysknews.com/Depts/society/gay_marriage.htm

http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com...exual_lies.htm

http://www.illinoisfamily.org/news/c...ew.asp?c=35169

http://lydiaswebpage.blogspot.com/20...omosexual.html

http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/arc...6/mar/06032407

http://www.sodahead.com/fun/pastor-j...estion-186524/

http://www.dakotavoice.com/2011/02/r...s-chick-fil-a/

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/news...-is-a-sin.html

http://www.article8.org/docs/news_ev...arker/main.htm

http://www.lansingcitypulse.com/lans...ts-church.html

http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/hom...e-in-sex-acts/

http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/abbott/101002

http://neiman.sayanythingblog.com/20...ous-opponents/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/ar...es-danger.html


Edit: And No Demento, posting links is NOT a way for people to make themselves feel as though they have won.
It's to provide real-life examples relevant to the discussion.


"And which law is that? I hope you don't mean the book written by people in the desert who thought rainbows and thunder were indicators of god's emotions?"

All the ways of gaining knowledge about ourselves and the world are complementary, but becomes counterproductive when they try to undermine one another. Natural Law is something you may want to check out. Natural Law is grounded in biology, logic, and common sense. Moral principles are revealed in Natural Law, and they have a logical basis, which allows for a common language for communication between believers and non believers. In other words, morality is reasonable, and not only a matter of faith.
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Old 02-25-2011   #12
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

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Old 02-26-2011   #13
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

I can't respond to this thread. even tho i REALLY want to. I can't because its fucked up shit like this that makes me avoid all human life & society currently. and if i engage it will only sour this little social retreat i have.
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Old 02-26-2011   #14
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

Here's an added dose of common sense to this issue...


http://theiowarepublican.com/home/20...-abandon-doma/
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Old 02-26-2011   #15
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

Alan Sears of ADF has just released a letter on the implications of the Obama Administration and Justice Department's refusal to defend existing Defense of Marriage Act (1996) legislation:

http://www.colsoncenter.org/hottopics/entry/31/16504
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Old 02-26-2011   #16
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

Just to make a few things clear because many of the sources cited by Funk get some basic facts wrong.

In the "dose of common sense" link featuring Ron Paul, Paul states this:
Quote:
Originally Said by Ron Paul
“Today’s announcement that the Obama Administration will abandon its obligation to enforce DOMA is truly disappointing and shows a profound lack of respect for the Constitution and the Rule of Law. President Obama has just unconstitutionally said that Iowa should have to allow San Francisco and New York City decide its marriage laws. That position is unacceptable.
From what I understand, this is incorrect.

The Administration is only declining to defend the constitutionality of Section 3 (which forbids federal government recognition of same sex marriages contracted in the states), while continuing to argue the provisions in DOMA that allow states to refuse to recognize same-sex marriages contracted elsewhere.

Actually, Ron Paul and other libertarians should approve of this move, which is anti-big government. It still allows states to determine marriage; it questions the notion that the federal government should ignore a state's decision to recognize same-sex marriage. And--again--nothing can actually happen until Congress or the Supreme Court changes the law.

Essentially, if Section 3 were overturned, it would mean this: If Oregon allows same-sex marriage, Arizona can still NOT recognize it; however, the federal government would recognize the same-sex marriages that happen in Oregon. As it currently stands, the federal government is denying to recognize a decision made by the states.

Quote:
Originally Said by funk
Alan Sears of ADF has just released a letter on the implications of the Obama Administration and Justice Department's refusal to defend existing Defense of Marriage Act (1996) legislation:

http://www.colsoncenter.org/hottopics/entry/31/16504
Sears says that this move by the Obama Administration is "unprecedented." This is wrong, most likely an intentional lie. Numerous administrations have done this:
http://www.justice.gov/olc/nonexcut.htm
http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?i...n=1&hbxlogin=1

Sears doesn't specify the part about Section 3, but instead makes it sound like Paul does--a complete overturning of DOMA.

Congress will probably step in and defend Section 3 of DOMA, so it's not as if no one will defend it.

But this has been overdramatized as a complete overturning of DOMA, which it is not.
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Old 02-26-2011   #17
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

^Which in turn undermines each individual state's ability to defend it. Yes, it should take more than a presidential announcement to repeal these vital and important federal laws. Unfortunately, President Obama's incremental decision on DOMA makes that very threat more of a reality.
And your argument and the sites you cite is predicated on the false belief that same sex attraction and gender identity confusion is immutable.

It undermines the states right to defend marriage up to the Supreme Court. And all we have to do is look to what is happening in Canada.
First, marriage is western society's most fundamental institution. As such, it is embedded throughout our law, child­rearing practices and culture in general. When marriage is redefined, other social institutions are likewise transformed. Second, when male-female marriage and same-sex "marriage" become equal in the eyes of the law, treating them differently becomes discrimination. If homosexuality was equal to heterosexuality, they wouldn't need the law to prove it as natural law, science, and logic does not.

In Canada, "privileging" male-female marriage in any way is now a violation of human rights. Canadians who believe in the historic definition of marriage, who believe that children need a mother and father, are now the legal equivalent of racists. Today, Canada is combing through its laws and institutions to remove evidence of "heterosexist" discrimination. Terms such as "husband" and "wife" are now forbidden across the spectrum of Canadian law and government programs.

The legal meaning of parenthood is being trans­formed, with consequences no one can predict. Canadian schools are becoming battlegrounds.
Children have to be taught about homosexual acts in health class, and are being introduced to it in elementary schools. If parents object, who should have every right to do because it is their children, they'll be branded as homophobes, which is a social construct.

Sounds farfetched? People who disagree with same-sex "marriage" risk charges of hate speech. In British Columbia, teacher Chris Kempling has been found guilty - and disciplined - for defending male-female marriage in newspaper opinion pieces. A bishop has been hauled before the Alberta Human Rights Tribunal for promoting traditional marriage in his pastoral letters. The human rights tribunals have become thought police.
In Canada, you can now use the coercive powers of the state to silence opposition.

Although the new Canadian federal law claims to exempt people from sanctions for expressing a belief in traditional marriage, the provision will likely prove meaningless. The courts and provincial governments, not the federal government, have the competence to decide such matters.
If someone tells you same-sex "marriage" won't affect your marriage, tell them to look at Canada. The evidence is building.

There is, in fact, a large body of evidence, which shows that homosexual relationships are not the equal of what heterosexual marriage is.
If we are to make the correct decision for this country, it behooves us to examine all sides of the situation.
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Old 02-28-2011   #18
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

http://fckh8.com/Bullies/
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Old 02-28-2011   #19
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

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Originally Said by SketchImpressions View Post
A book put out that outlines tactics of propaganda by homosexual activists on the masses. This book is called After The Ball, was published in 1989, and the tactics within the book were put forth by word-of-mouth and media propaganda by the homosexual activist groups. In 1989, just as the HIV/AID’s epidemic was taking root in American homosexual circles, this book was published. It was entitled ‘After the Ball: How America will Conquer its Fear and Hatred of Gay in the 90’s.’ It is claimed it is a prescient landmark in the homosexual rights movement

The authors, Marshall Kirk, a noted author and researcher in neuropsychiatry and Hunter Madsen, a Harvard-trained social scientist, both self-confessed homosexuals, set out a blueprint with which to enhance the respectability of homosexuality in the face of criticism. They were unabashed in using lies to counter what the majority of the public knew about homosexuality. They intended to psychologically attack the average American’s mind, emotions, and will through the use of propaganda via the media.

What they proposed was powerful propaganda in the form of a public relations strategy that involved three elements.



• Desentisitization - This involved flooding straight America with advertising presenting homosexuals in the least offensive manner.



• Jamming - Equate the fear of homosexuals with hatred of Jews, blacks, and women.


• Conversion - Presenting images of homosexuals as normal.


They planned eight strategic principles for specific public attention...



• Don’t just express yourself: communicate!


• Appeal to the Ambivalent Skeptics.


• Keep talking about gayness.


• Keep your issue focused: the issue is homosexuality.


• Portray homosexuals as victims, even if you have to fabricate, and never as aggressive challengers.


• Give potential protectors a just cause.


• Make homosexualss look good.


• Make people who disagree with homosexuality look bad.



The authors say, ‘In any campaign to win over the public, homosexualss must be portrayed as victims in need of protection, so that straights will be inclined by reflex to adopt the role of protector."

They observe, ‘Thus propagandistic advertising can depict all opponents of the homosexual movement as "homophobic bigots" who are 'not Christian,' and the propaganda can further show them as being criticized, hated, and shunned. Additionally, ‘Our effect is achieved without reference to facts, logic, or proof...the person's beliefs can be altered whether he is conscious of the attack or not.’


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cUXmphzU3o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqfUmLZq5as

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbSlkqsUW7Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neggpBAKjwA
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Old 02-28-2011   #20
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Re: Obama Disses DOMA

Have you ever read the book "Death of the Liberal Class?" by Chris Hedges?
I think you would really enjoy this book, or at least find what it has to say very interesting. Our country has always been about twisting and controlling information to better suit the needed political climate of the time.
I agree with your opinion about propaganda being used to change the cultural mindset about gays, and that some lies have been told. But I really wish you would pick something else to be so passionate about. ya know..... like something that would actually improve lives or this country.
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